Yeah so this is J-pop not K-pop but I don't give a fuck because the same insanity leads to it. Apparently Miss Minegishi Minami of AKB48 was caught having a sleepover with a boy idol so management does what? Well they don't fire her like others because she is too popular. Instead they drop her back down to trainee and make her shave off her hair and apologize to fans and then publish this for all the world to see.
On the one hand I don't want to show you and add to her public humiliation, but on the other hand I think if viewed in the right attitude the video should only be a shame to her management. Ultimately the former won out, so you can go find it yourself if you want to see what the insane fanboy/fangirl mindset does.
What I want to draw attention to is that they did this to satiate the rage of psychotic possessive fanboys. This is the kind of disgusting, dehumanizing thing that the mindset leads to and outside of rape and sexual assault this is the worst I have seen an agency do to one of their idols. She has been made a shame unto the whole country and for what? For being a human being and having feelings for someone and wanting to be with them.
Fuck you, insane possessive fanboys.
Fuck you agency for fully playing to them.
Fuck you "slut"-shaming culture of hypocrisy.
Fuck all you crazy ass fanboys and fangirls who would pressure agencies to hinder idols from knowing and sharing love like normal human beings.
Fuck anyone in Japan who sees this happening in their culture and doesn't say shit against it.
You sick motherfuckers.
It's like Unit 731 all over again.
ReplyDelete=/
ReplyDeleteWe need a spinoff: Anti Jpop-Fanboy.
ReplyDeleteAnti Yaeba-Rapist feat. sulli_fag
Delete"drop her back down to trainee and make her shave off her hair" What the actual fuck??? Is that even legal?
ReplyDeleteWell the official story is that she decided to do it herself without telling anyone. Obviously if it was their idea they would make her say that anyway to cover their own asses because yeah it would probably be crossing legal lines. They can fire her since it's in her agreement, so demotion is obviously within their bounds. I find it all too convenient that they just happened to keep her around instead of fire her like some less popular members. Maybe it was pity after she shaved her head, or maybe the shaving was their way of harsh punishment without firing her like the others. I know what I think, but no matter what the reality is between it being from her or the agency, if it weren't for the fanboys being like they are it never would have happened.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI just watched the video. This is too much
ReplyDeleteHoly Balls, chill out Japan.
ReplyDeleteReally fucking disgusting.
ReplyDeleteThe entire management should be hanged for doing this.
otaku fans are inherent in Kpop and Jpop. What they need to do is get a real girlfriend/boyfriend and stop fantasizing over people they will never meet/don't have a chance with. This is the one problem i have with asian pop music. It really relies on the heartstrings/obsession of their otaku fans aka losers who can't get dates. They get jealous if the idol they like dates somebody. The idol pretty much has to be their virtual lover and its sickening that music has become that shallow. I'd even go on to say it negatively impacts their society, feeding into the loneliness problem in japan.
ReplyDeleteIn the west, besides One Direction and Bieber, we don't really have this problem among pop music fans. And all the artists are allowed to freely date and the relationship between fans and singers is more of a friendship/admiration and not lust/obesession.
They shaved off her hair? That´s what the French did to their women for collaborating with nazi soldiers back in the 40ies.
ReplyDeleteNot just the French, considering the Dutch did the same thing. Anyone who had a relationship with a German soldier (whether if he was a Nazi or not) got pretty beaten bad.
DeleteThey did it because it for the honor
ReplyDeleteYou're part of the problem. You said you didn't want to add to her public humiliation but you also thought posting about it... on AKF of all places is going to bring shame to her management. Posting that on this blog isn't going to do shit but cause more more people go out and view that video. Good job. Pat yourself on the back for being a real women's rights advocate.
ReplyDeleteThere is nothing inherently shameful about what she did or short hair. The shame comes not from people simply seeing it, but from the agency controlling the narrative when they do. If you don't look on her with compassion after reading this article, there is no helping you. I don't know any advocacy organization that responds to active public attack of character with acquiescence toward the lies of distortion from the offenders. You always take back the narrative to get individual power and dignity back. Social change never comes from working in secret or pretending the issue will just disappear if you prosecute the offenders at each point of contention as it comes up.
DeleteYou're seriously deluding yourself if you think posting this here is going to cause any social change. The only thing you're accomplishing is bring more views to that video and increasing her humiliation.
DeleteAlso according to her statement they didn't make her shave her heard, she did it herself so your article is misleading in that regard. That's besides the point though. The way women are treated is based on 1000s of years of tradition and raging against it on a comedy centered k-pop blog is going to do virtually nothing but attract more gawkers to her public shaming.
You addressed that point about making her do it.
DeleteI fully agree, there is nothing getting the message out about her public shaming as long as you are not contributing to the vitriole that is infesting the world, in this case Japan. Yes, it is unlikely that her management will either see or respond to this video, but at least it condemns a culture of "slut"-shaming.
DeleteJust like how America needs to reflect on how we shamed Kristen Stewart and yet, the witch hunt has not extended to either Justin Bieber or Zayn Malik (the latter of One Direction) for performing similar transgressions.
Fuck slut-shaming and fuck those that don't respond to it.
I mean I agree with Ahjusshi, and the thing is, exposing it for what it is, a horrible societal expectation, is just that.
DeleteI'm all for condemning it. But in a constructive way that actually accomplishes something. If you accept that there's no chance of her management seeing this article and there's zero chance of this changing anything; I assume most everyone here already disagrees with this, if not speak up... Then you have to look at what's left by doing this. Bringing more views.
DeleteYou're all focused on the macro side of things, what society accepts in regards to women. That's all well and good, but like I keep going back to. Posting that here is not going to change or accomplish anything on that side of it. So you look at the micro side of things, this girl specifically, and this is doing nothing for her but causing further humiliation.
"The tradition is too long-standing, to deep, too powerful, they will never listen."
DeleteLike with minority rights? Like with other womens rights? Like with homosexuals?
It has been proven that change does happen. It happens slowly, but it happens when people start pointing out when something in culture is fucked up. I don't intend to change all of Japan with this post. I intend to plant a seed in the mind of people who read it, a seed that might grow into a vine that helps choke their bigotry and fnaboy/fangirl insanity.
And that analogy is precisely what I mean. Few people ever read something and go "You know, this is right. I will change my worldview and all my actions now." but rather the good and reasonable words they have heard from others nag at them, and if given the opportunity in one instance, they are less likely to do what was condemned so strongly elsewhere. And after they notice themselves acting differently for a while, they change their official stance.
Yes, this is mostly a joke site, but it is also a rant site at times. So long as you aren't a total dumbass you should be able to tell the difference between us being serious and us not being serious. If you actually have evidence that this article is compounding the problem, bring it forward. Otherwise stop nagging me with your imaginary majority of people who are so devoted to slut-shaming that they would completely ignore what I said.
But here's the difference. It has already blown up in the popular media. Also, this post avoids certain things to prevent her shame: it does not link to her apology video, it does not even fully direct her. The first sentence says, "Apparently she did A, so management does what?" The rest is chronicling her management and not her, and the first sentence is just a statement of what the popular press reported without any strings attached, in fact, it favors her side. The point of this blod is not vindicate her actions through ritualistic actions, it is to denounce the culture and particularly her management that caused this to happen. She is a subject referred to passively (intentionally, saying she "was caught", "has been made"): in short, the actions are imposed upon her which the article references in full.
DeleteIf she was an average citizen, I would agree, but she is a public figure who is being unjustly treated.
Like I said, judging from the comments most everyone here already knows this is a messed up situation, it doesn't take a human rights activist to recognize that. But if you thinking you're planting some kind of "seeds of change" that will lead to societal change in Japan helps you sleep at night, more power to you.
DeleteI'm sorry you consider reasoned debate "nagging". If you just can't handle disseminating opinions and want to post in an echo chamber do it elsewhere. Attacking me and implying I'm a dumbass is nothing but a classic straw man.
Asking me to bring up some kind of evidence that you're compounding the problem is a burden of proof fallacy as well. Me proving anything doesn't automatically make what you're doing any less wrong.
If even one person from this blog watches that video you made a mistake. Like I keep saying you're focused on the macro side of things which you will do virtually nothing against, I'm focused on what's best for this individual.
To Alex:
If it's already in mainstream media then there's even less reason to post this here other than for the OP to stand on his soapbox to show how much an awesome person he is, at the expense of this girl's humiliation. That really makes it seem that much worse. Saying, "I'm not going to link it here, but here's her name and you can just google it" is virtually the same thing. There's no proof her management made her to do anything. You can assume as much as you want but for now we only have the comany's statement to go on.
"If even one person from this blog watches that video you made a mistake."
DeleteSince this is your whole point, please support it, since you seem to think so highly of your "reasoned debate" here and it directly contradicts my view that the narrative context by which someone views something is what makes it shameful or not. What about the simple act of viewing the video inherently carries so much wrong that it outweighs any positive outlooks that the article provides?
Also, aren't you putting responsibility on me for something that is another person's free choice and responsibility? If someone wants to completely ignore me and be a force of hatred, they would do that with or without my article. You haven't provided any alternatives for how to effectively condemn an action against her and stand up for/support her while somehow magically blocking haters from getting information. It's really a stupid notion and makes one think you believe inaction is how you stand up for the persecuted.
And just so you know, you seem to be less willing to move forward through this thing than the girl herself. Here is something posted on twitter with her supportive friends who are tweeting encouragement: http://i.imgur.com/0cGnEgw.jpg
You made a point of not linking the video because you thought it would contribute to her public humiliation, which I agree with but now you're downplaying that because of a twitter picture? I don't understand, what you're saying by that last paragraph? I care too much about the issue to drop it? If so, thanks.
DeleteIgnoring you does not automatically make someone a "force of hatred". You keep making assumptions and jumping to these huge conclusions. It's a fallacy to say that because I don't think you should have posted this that I'm now responsible for thinking up some sort of alternative. There are a number of ways you can condemn this without bringing further attention to it, email or phone her label, for one. That you insist on posting this and bringing further attention to it just adds to the notion you're doing this more for your own ego than for the good of this person. It isn't a stupid notion to say inaction is how you stand up for the persecuted, it's one you just made up as you've been doing throughout this debate.
"Ignoring you does not automatically make someone a "force of hatred". You keep making assumptions and jumping to these huge conclusions."
DeleteYou need to learn how to keep track of premises in an argument. As I have already said multiple times, my stance is that the video would only be her humiliation if the person viewing it would judge her. If they 1) found out about the video through my article and b) are judging her then that would mean c) they are ignoring my points and choosing a hateful narrative.
"It's a fallacy to say that because I don't think you should have posted this that I'm now responsible for thinking up some sort of alternative."
To *effectively* denounce my actions rather than just make assertions as if they were self-evident, yes you would.
"There are a number of ways you can condemn this without bringing further attention to it, email or phone her label, for one."
This speaks nothing to the larger cultural problem. If you hadn't noticed, this blog is dedicated to denouncing fangirls and fanboys for their psychotic mindsets and the things which result from them. If you have a problem with that, you have a problem with the entire website.
"That you insist on posting this and bringing further attention to it just adds to the notion you're doing this more for your own ego than for the good of this person."
I REALLY haven't been appreciating this narrative you've tried to build the last few posts. You challenge what merit or value my post might have and so I defend it and then you try and use that defense to characterize me as some boastful person thinking so highly of myself and posting it for my own image? You're lucky that I'm remaining civil at all with this kind of immature attack.
My thoughts and intentions were purely at condemning what I found to be an attack on this girl for something that is only natural. You can debate whether or not it is the right response to such a thing, but trying to turn it on me is poor form and one of those fallacies that you seem so adverse to.
"It isn't a stupid notion to say inaction is how you stand up for the persecuted, it's one you just made up as you've been doing throughout this debate."
Funny, I feel like you're the one who has been making stuff up. You still haven't explained how merely seeing the video inherently compounds the humiliation of the girl. You reference to my comment in the article, but I meant that in reference to easy access to viewing it, which would discourage or distract people from reading the condemnation of what led to the video first (my argument on narratives impacting the nature of reception), if you had already forgotten that premise as you did before)
Nope, it's a burden of proof fallacy and I don't waste time debating fallacies.
DeleteAlso I could not care less if you remain civil with me or not. If I'm upsetting you that's your own problem and if you can't debate civilly, that speaks more about your maturity and level of discourse then it does about me. I believe you didn't post this for purely altruistic reasons and that's just how I feel. You don't need to prove your reasons for posting this, that's not what I'm arguing about. That you're getting so upset about it hints there's at least some grain of truth to it.
Posting this on this blog will not cause anything to happen other than for more people to view that video. You're delusional if you think otherwise. If you're going to argue that it's part of some "larger" force than once again, the part this post will serve is so small so as to be negligible.
I understand the purpose of this website, it's one of my favorite blogs. This isn't a fanboy problem though, this is a cultural problem. Even if I disagreed with everything posted here that doesn't mean I can't post my two cents. You seem to want an echo chamber with no opposing viewpoints to anything posted.
To me, causing more people to see her being shamed like that outweighs any perceived good you're doing in the grand scheme of things. It compounds the humiliation of this girl because the whole purpose of slut-shaming is for people to look at some girl with disdain and that's exactly what you're contributing to, hence why I said you're part of the problem.
"Nope, it's a burden of proof fallacy and I don't waste time debating fallacies."
DeleteBurden of proof is not a fallacy, it is a requirement to be considered valid. The only time it is a fallacy is when you try to require it of someone it does not fall on, such as saying someone needs to prove unicorns doesn't exist in order to say that they don't. However, when you make an assertion, a positive claim, you have to back it up if you want people to take you seriously. You have only asserted that people seeing the video in any sense whatsoever compounds her public humiliation. If you can't back that up with reasons why you would think this, you are clearly full of shit and making a fight out of nothing.
"That you're getting so upset about it hints there's at least some grain of truth to it."
No, it means I don't appreciate people making up lies and trying perpetuate a negative characterization of me that they invented to try and make themselves look more reasonable. It's obvious that when you share this "personal" view in a public argument that you are trying to make others think of me the same way. There is no other reason to openly declare such personal suspicions.
The same goes for all your other little jabs and insinuations about me. They have nothing to do with my arguments, but rather are creating a little sideshow to distract from the fact you aren't dealing with any arguments. Merely taking on a persona of being the rational and collected one doesn't make it true of you. You have to live up to the role by demonstrating how reality and your perspective align.
"Posting this on this blog will not cause anything to happen other than for more people to view that video. You're delusional if you think otherwise."
Again, you are making claims about things as though they are self-evident when they are not. Not only lacking any evidence, but not even attempting to explain your reasoning for thinking as much, which can only lead me to assume that you have no reasoning and that you're making declarations out feelings with no substance. "To me" is a feeling, it carries no weight of validity on its own.
You're more than welcome to hold that belief, but again, that's imposing an assumption on our readers. You're assuming that everyone who looks up that video will scorn her or otherwise slut-shame her when the overwhelming response to it, whether here at AKF or say Tokyohive, has been outrage at her mistreatment and deepest of sympathies for her. If we hadn't posted an article on this, many people (myself included) might not ever have known this had even occured. Wouldn't you say that's a bigger contributor to the problem at hand?
DeleteIf no one knows about an atrocity, a mistreatment, or injustice, it may as well be a silent condonement of said event. That's why things like the Holocaust or the Armenian Genocide are so important to their respective communities; so people can know exactly what happened, so people can form their own opinions on the matter, and so people can take action to prevent such a thing from ever happening again. By your argument, the pictures of emaciated and naked Jews should never be published or viewed by people because that would contribute to the shaming and humiliation that the Nazis intended.
I'm not saying that this issue is of equal magnitude to the Holocaust (and goddamn myself for invoking Godwin's Law), but the analogy holds. What Ahjussi and I are saying is it's unfair to simply assume that bringing awareness of this issue will contribute to some kind of shaming or negate the benefits of bringing awareness to this issue in the first place. People should be able to watch the video and figure out for themselves what exactly this means to them. If people want to open up the video and cackle to themselves over how big of a slut Minegishi Minami is and how she had the whole thing coming to her, so be it. If people want to open up the video and use it as an example of how draconic the idol industry is and how unjustly Minegishi Minami is being treated, so be it.
To not report this would be censorship.
That's not what burden of proof means. You're doing the same thing you accuse me of, creating a sideshow by arguing over semantics to distract from your own flimsy arguments.
DeleteOf course I'm saying this from my own point of view. That's the whole definition of a viewpoint. To me, you're just as much responsible for the slut-shaming going on here as the company that supposedly put her up to it. What isn't my viewpoint is the fact you've enabled people to partake in this slut-shaming and therefore you are responsible. What opinions people take away from it are beside the point.
To me, encouraging slut-shaming as a viable means of punishment by giving more eyes to it, isn't worth whatever good you think it does, which you yet to prove exists by the way.
e: posted instead of reply
To argue the purely rational-constructive side from a different angle...
DeleteWhat you are doing is like saying that if you show people magnets, they will believe they are magical objects, and that explaining magnetic fields and polarization to them won't change how they view it at all. That "to you" that is just how it is, and you have no evidence, and you refuse to give any reasons why you think that is what will happen if people see magnets, but you think a person is delusional to believe otherwise.
In terms of the construction of arguments, that is exactly what is happening here. Don't you see that you have given no one a reason to take you seriously? Even if it's just sharing your perspective and nothing more (and btw arguing with others would imply otherwise) there is no point in sharing something without any real-world value for consideration let alone substance for action or change of actions. I don't require that everyone agree with me, but I do expect them to at least have a rationality of their own, not convictions made of nothing.
And again, about the insinuations of my character, the rules of logical fallacies don't apply to addressing these. Those are for when you are trying to prove something, but insinuations are not an attempt to prove anything, they are more cowardly than that. It is a social subversion and nobody is going to stand by and allow you to do that to them.
Trying to come out looking clean by pointing out the fact you made no formal arguments but were only sharing how you felt changes nothing about the affront. We aren't stupid. We all know exactly what you are doing when you paint a negative picture of someone when it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. That is a social play, not a point of rational debate. Denying it when you are called out on it is weak.
And sorry, but you are straight-up wrong about the burden of proof. What it means is that if you make a positive claim, you hold the burden to prove that claim by means of reasoning and/or evidence.
Deletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_burden_of_proof
You have made a positive claim about the effects of viewing the video regardless of context and have given no reasoning or evidence for why you think that which you do. The burden still lies on you to support that assertion. Until you do, you have given nobody any reason to share your feelings or even consider them a valid position to hold.
It's not my responsibility to get people to take me seriously. You read my posts and do with it what you will. I'm stating my viewpoint on why I don't think you should have posted this, that's all. What you do with that is up to you. If you want to debate me for two hours that's fine, if you want to ignore me because you don't take me seriously that's fine too (btw arguing with me would imply otherwise).
DeleteI've made my formal complaint several times now. You keep stating there's some kind of witch-hunt out to paint you in a bad light. So to me, that you keep sidestepping the argument and portraying yourself as some victim of a character assassination further lends credence to the notion this all about some kind of ego stroking.
Ah, attempting to turn my defense against your attacks into a reinforcement of the original attack. Nice try. Way too obvious, though.
DeleteAnyway, it seems like you have resigned to "I was just saying" which is the cowards concession, so I guess we are done here as you have no will to provide anything beyond declarations of your own empty convictions. I'm done with this dance.
Nope, you're a dipshit with your crappy logic.
DeleteGlobal outrage to bullshit posted on YouTube has changed things before and it could now.
The solution isn't to have people ignore it and pretend it never happened, because then their attitudes only become reinforced internally and the barbaric practices continue.
I think AKF should have posted the video and should have let people see. Make it spread and open it up to criticism around the world, because I guarantee none of the backlash will be on her and all of it will be on the company.
Nothing changes? Really? In Asia, the opinions of netizens and fans have an abnormally significant effect on what companies do. I hope this goes viral and it causes people to question the role of rules like this.
They should.
Ah, the "I'm done with this waah!".
DeleteAnyway, it seems like you have resigned to crying like a child, picking up your toys and leaving. That's fine. Like I said before it reflects more on your maturity and level of discourse than it does on me.
If this helps you sleep at night knowing you contributed to this slut-shaming then good for you.
Does it help you sleep at night to know that you're seriously suggesting the superior option is to ignore that it happened and do nothing about it, thus allowing the status quo to persist?
DeleteMuch better job you're doing.
2:32 PM "if you want to ignore me because you don't take me seriously that's fine too"
Delete2:42 PM "Anyway, it seems like you have resigned to crying like a child, picking up your toys and leaving"
You aren't fooling anyone. You literally ceased to offer anything new and stated as much. There is nothing to continue a debate with as all points brought up have been addressed multiple times. You are only continuing with attacks on my character.
There won't be any global uproars over this because nobody really gives a damn about a lame-ass B-list idol. Yes, overseas fans will be outraged by such atrocity being committed upon a young lady. But the agency couldn't care any less because they barely contribute a dime to company offer. It's those notoriously self-indulgent, possessive and maniacal fanboys from whom the agency derives most of its revenue. So it only makes perfect business sense for their fragile, perverted feelings to be catered to by the agency.
DeleteAnd for people who don't follow JPop, there are much more important things to concern themselves with than poking fun at victims of idol culture in some eccentric Asian countries e.g. which porn should I fap to tonight, much less slut-shaming her for merely being faithful to human nature i.e. mating.
I can see the rationales behind ice_princess's argument: the fastest way to have the "scandal" died down and the girl turning over a new leaf is to have people quit generating more buzz about it. But the damage is already done when she "voluntarily" made a public apology with shaven head. The very traumatized experience will probably haunt the girl for the rest of her life. It makes no fundamental difference to the girl whether this article can mobilize 100 Kpop fans to watch the public-shaming video of a Jpop idol.
That's what you believe, but all it takes is somebody e-mailing this to Jezebel or The Huffington Post on a slow news day and for enough people to think it's disgusting and that's how the ball gets rolling. Far less relevant shit than this has gone viral before.
DeletePlus, I don't see how any outpouring of support is gonna make her feel worse exactly. Like more views on the video means they're all people viewing it to shame her? More likely to dissect it and call it bullshit.
Also, odd that you would say it's impossible for people to care given what has JUST happened with another AKB48 idol. How many people know who Kasai Tomomi is? Even now, nobody cares about her, specifically, but her scandal got enough concern in Japan that serious action is being taken, and they specifically cited worry about how it would be perceived internationally.
They will probably tone down on the public humiliation part to avoid excessive negative publicity in future. But the decades old phenomenon of idol exploitation and agency playing puppeteer over their lives will persist unless Japanese make a stand against it and say enough is enough. The agency will only take international outrage over this scandal into consideration insofar its profit contingents on overseas revenue. Unfortunately, incomes derived by Jpop from international market pales in comparison to domestic ones. Obsessive fanboyism is the driving force behind the agency's revenue and growth, leading to their perversion taking precedence over rationality and sanity. Analogously, Japan's whaling program is roundly condemned by environmentally conscious people around the world, but much to the dismay of environmental groups the Japanese government remains indifferent to international consensus in light of it having a vested interest in the whaling industry: electoral support of this particular interest group.
DeleteThere's no denying that money talks, and talks the loudest. The punishment being dished out to the girl serves no purpose other than to appease fanboys who regard their idols having sex as blasphemy of the highest order. If sufficient international condemnation has been garnered, the agency may no longer opt for the route of public humiliation. But one way or the other, punitive actions (exile/relegation to trainee group doesn't serve one's dignity/self esteem any better, having worked so hard to earn a berth among AKB48's elites) must be taken against idols who defy their much "celebrated" celibate idol lifestyle, lest the floodgate be blasted wide open and fanboys left devastated and disillusioned by the fact that their idols are just as lustful as the rest of us.
To precipitate any sweeping changes, either someone knock some common senses into the collective heads of those crazy ass fan boys/girls. Or revenue from overseas markets, where fans in general are more open-minded about idol dating and value individualism over conformity, outweighs domestic revenue. I honestly can't see either of these alternatives happening any time soon.........So poor those Jpop idols, they will go on living as deprived as ever........
This is fucking insane! I feel so sick. I just read about the thing on Tokyo Hive and felt sick to my gut. This is horrible, she can't help if she's fallen in love with someone even though her agency doesn't allow it. This is inhumane and horrible. How dare they make her shave off her hair and demote her to trainee level! It's cruel! What about human fucking rights! DISGUSTING!
ReplyDeleteThank you! One of the most humane articles I've seen on this website.
ReplyDeleteAnd yes this is fucking disgusting. I ended up seeing the video and just watching her drop tears as she talked was... heartbreaking. Her life, everything she's worked hard for since she was like 12/13, all destroyed by the stupid agency because she wanted to feel love.
I'm really surprised, even Sasshi got reprimanded less and Sasshi-Gate was a BIG ASS DEAL. Well, who knows, maybe this will help Miichan in the election? instead of Paruru or even worse...Milky rising maybe Miichan can rise as her fans (the sensible, non crazy wotas) try to show they still support her.
ReplyDeleteI look at the good side, atleast it was Micchan who can easily over-come something like this with her humor and not someone like Matsui Rena, Yukirin or Mayu who's fans (pyscho possessive fanboys) would've gone bat-shit and jumped off of the top floor of Tokyo Tower by now, forcing them into isolation for the rest of their lives.
I thought Miichan's fans were cooler than this. At least she's too popular to be fired. Not like Nacchan. Poor Miichan. Japan takes their "pure idol image" very seriously.
I think seeing psycho possessive fanboys jumping off from the top floor of the Tokyo Tower would have been preferable .___. At least the world can a few less crazies that way.
DeleteI'm pretty sure this opinion will get hated on but... I can't quite take the same perspective as you. In the end, she knew what kinda contract she was signing and knew the consequences. She didn't have to shave her head (other sex-related scandals within the 48 didn't result in members shaving their heads) but honestly, I don't see it as just a 'slut-shaming' thing or a 'possessive fanboy' thing because Johnnys get crapped on too for their scandals. It's an idol thing and if anything, fans are the ones who need to change their mindset on how they view these idols. They get marketed a certain way because that's what the people want. And I agree it's messed up but I would expect to see more people trying to fight that but well... if she KNEW the contract said you can't do this and then go and do it... and she's only been demoted. The punishment could've been a lot worse (like getting kicked out if anything) but I feel like this went kinda far (the reaction with people) due to her shaving her head because she went to that extreme. I'm sure half of the 48 girls are getting some... (not saying anything about love because um... well for all we know she could've just wanted sex. Her choice) she just... didn't hide it well enough.
ReplyDeleteBut that's the main issue with the idol world in Japan/Korea. They sexualize them (either in a super in your face I show my body to you, or that innocent/pure senpai oppa I loooove you teehee) to make them desirable but unattainable and well, it would ruin the 'image' they have so from the agency point of view, it kinda sucks on them too because it is still supply/demand with it. But, just my perspective on the issue. I personally wouldn't sign a contract like that honestly and also wouldn't want to go through so much crap to hide my privacy. This what makes the idol world (more so the idol world, especially when involving young adults) tricky and complicated.
This is long-winded for sure.
DeleteWell I'm going to say that I partially agree with you; If you have a contract, stick to it and if you want to date, graduate. However, that's much easier said than done. For lower ranked girls it much easier to leave; they’ve got minimal amounts of fans and they earn practically nothing, it’s not so easy for Miichan who has basically grown up in AKB to say she wants to have a boyfriend so she is graduating in two weeks. And for a founding member like MIichan, getting demoted to KKS is humiliating and harsh. She was in AKB before it was AKB, she is probably some of those girls oshi, she shouldn't have to train with them when she is probably one of the members who inspired them to audition in the first place but anyways...
I don’t agree on the last bit about how AKB is marketed and I’m going to say it is more a possessive fanboy thing. In general, AKB is marketed as “idols you can meet” and not everybody fits into the “perfect idol” mold. Actually, AKB has only 3 girls that fit the image Japan has of a “perfect idol" that you were describing with the subtle sexiness. Miichan isn’t one of them so the reasons her fans are mad is more so related to how she presents herself; attainable (which goes with AKB’s theme) but also incapable which attracts many wota. It’s because she didn’t hold up the personal, “incapable,” end of the bargain that has caused all the chaos and is a consequence of possessive fanboys.
Miichan has built her name in AKB using jokes and gags to become known as “the funny one.” It’s good for getting your name out there to the fans when trying to compete with 200+ other girls for attention but the “hetare” and “comedic” personalities these girls present to fans are more double edged than they think. On the positive side, they have more freedom to express themselves, however, on the negative side, fans hold them to these cultivated personalities, so, when you say you’re “hetare” and can’t get a date or you’re just the “funny one” so no-one wants to date you, the fans are going to hold you to it. They want to see that “hetare” personality warding off men. When you build an image based on the lie that you are incapable and then it’s shown that you are in-fact capable, situations like this occur.
AKB's most popular members amongst wota are the "orthodox idols" Rena, Yuki and Mayu. They have “anything for the fans” personalities. Sure, their fans are the most possessive and the craziest but they wouldn’t be anything without crazy wota supporting them so they make the sacrifice to shake hands for 11 hours straight and smile 24/7. Look at any of the AKB forums on popular Japanese sites. They want “safe and trustworthy” idols Rena, Yuki and Mayu who have taken the route of orthodox idol and built their careers on being unattainable to ANY man to lead AKB. That’s what most idol wota want; idols that they can fantasize about that if they can’t have, no-one can. It's all about possession with these fans. If wota thought RYM weren't perfect orthodox idols that would sacrifice their happiness for the sake of their fans, they wouldn't be nearly as popular as they are with wota.
Miichan is being slut-shamed and called a liar. AKB is a harsh world.
Mayu and Yuki won't even talk to Nacchan after she got caught with a boy. They don't want their wota to think they are tainted by someone like her. And she was an original Team B member with them for 5 or 6 years by that point and she was in the WH7 sub-unit with Mayu. How harsh is that?
Yes, the "they should have known better what they have signed up for" is a well-trodden argument, but I have serious reservations about whether those contracts are legally binding to begin with. For contracts that are inherently discriminatory, exploitative or outright illegal, their very nature will render them legally voidable. An agency certainly doesn't have any legal authority to confine a 20 years old adult woman to mandatory celibacy, much less lynching via public shaming once the clause is breached.
DeleteBut I know that the idol world is a place fraught with harsh reality, where beneath its glossy facade lies immense cruelty. Being an idol in Asia is tantamount to waving goodbye to one's true self and taking up a manufactured personality conceived and shoved down the collective throats of fans and idols alike by idol agency.
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ReplyDeleteyet another person acting as if we are the most disgusting people in the world, you must be Korean.
If someone decides to kidnap management along with the extremist fanboy turds and send them over to China in the middle of an anti-Japanese protest/riot, I'll be getting my popcorn.
ReplyDeleteBut damn, to shave a girl's head for just that? That is bloody fucking insane.
They could have just I dunno, put her on extensive hiatus instead? It's not like she fucked some ChiCom or something.
Well like it was pointed out, she did that on her own. Doesn't make it any less disgusting though. If they're putting that kind of pressure on her where she thinks she has to do that then that's fucked up. I wonder what exactly her contract says w/r/t being with a boy, if anything. I doubt she could sue for emotional damages or anything. Isn't an idol suing their label basically unheard of in Korea/Japan?
DeleteI pretty much consider it hardly different, the line between forcing and pressuring/coercing at can be pretty blurry and hard to distinguish when it comes to the idol world.
DeleteNot sure about suing though if one looks at KARA, JYJ and Block B, disputes at court are probably gonna happen more frequently in the near future.
That aspect of their contacts has been found to be legally indefensible.
Deletehttp://www.japantimes.co.jp/community/2013/01/22/how-tos/akb48-unionize-and-take-back-your-lost-love-lives/
But they'll probably never stand up for themselves unless the fans support them in it.
This won't happen any time soon unless their perverted Japanese fanboys stage mass protests in support of sweeping reforms to the inhumane exploitation and confinement suffered by their idols. Unfortunately, I can't see this coming since fanboys are the ones who countenance the incumbent system in which they're supposed to be the biggest beneficiaries (well, if you count sexual fantasies and delusions as actual benefits).
DeleteThese sorts of people are the living embodiment of contradictions. On the one hand, they're all for porns in which girls are exploited, dehumanized, objectified in every conceivable and inconceivable ways just to vent their sexual deprivation. On the other hand, crazy fanboys condemn the very idols to whom they have professed love and loyalty to live equally exploited and deprived life as porno actresses, although on the other end of the spectrum.....
@Ajuhssi - they could always go on strike at the cost of their careers ;) Not so knowledgeable about AKB-48 as a whole but surely a good number of them are wondering just how irrelevant they are compared to other members.
Delete@timchan - Them crazy fanboys....I wonder, just what is the estimate of AKB-48's fanboys that are in their 20s to 50s are obsessed with their sexual delusions? I got a feeling a massive portion of them are likely to be just that.
Shit, this now reminds me of that 34-year-old Kpop girl group stanner I wrote a few times about.
lol, they can always go on a strike but any such industrial actions will probably be permanent. There are literally hundreds, if not thousands of pretty, young females (well, not necessarily pretty but definitely young. I am not really into this "48" shit because I find most of these girls mundane, or outright hideous looking)candidates who are eager to take up the incumbents' places once vacant. Idols who are openly defiant of their agency will never again attain employment in the Jpop industry, the only door that remains open by then will pertain to the adult entertainment.....
DeleteYes, timchan is right about idols being blacklisted. Suzuki Ami was huge in the 90s, on par with Hamasaki Ayumi and Amuro Namie. She defied her company, got blacklisted, and had to go the indie route, and she finally secured another major label contract 6-7 years later. She's the exception, and she only made it back because of how wildly popular she used to be. If an AKB48 girl leaves, there's 900 crooked-teeth-having-zoo-animal-resembling girls to take her place.
DeleteJanuary 31, 2013 at 2:38 PM "Anyway, it seems like you have resigned to "I was just saying" which is the cowards concession, so I guess we are done here as you have no will to provide anything beyond declarations of your own empty convictions. I'm done with this dance."
ReplyDeleteJanuary 31, 2013 at 3:03 PM "You aren't fooling anyone. You literally ceased to offer anything new and stated as much. There is nothing to continue a debate with as all points brought up have been addressed multiple times. You are only continuing with attacks on my character."
And now you're simply clinging on getting the last word in.
Also I have no idea who Asian Junkie is but trolls aren't worth my time or effort.
There is a difference between getting the last word in on a debate and not letting a person get away with fleeting attacks on your character. The debate is over, but you apparently will not let go until you can get an undefended jab against me. As I said, you aren't fooling anyone. Your facade of taking the high road is ineffective at covering the truth.
DeleteYou're arguing over semantics and you dismiss my point as a trolling attempt?
Deletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_lapidem
Whatever makes you feel better.
If you got no idea who Asian Junkie is, then try opening your eyes by looking at the 'Affiliates' list. It'll be hard to miss.
DeleteI am now butthurt cause I was ignored in favor of Asian Junkie.
DeleteIt's OK zaku, I'll ignore you. ;)
DeleteHonestly, Asian Junkie's argument is pretty solid, to the point of almost being impervious to rebuttal.
Deleteice_princess: lol
Delete아저씨: Facade is a pretty strong move when used in tandem with toxic orb on Gliscor.
Asian Junkie: Damn son.
Scatter_88mil: To be fair, nobody really gives a shit about affiliates.
Soyeon Friend: Don't you have another account to be using?
timchan: Indeed.
Yea well, it doesn't take someone with extremely good eyesight to really notice the name 'Asian Junkie' is at the affiliates list at the right side of the screen in this blog.
DeleteI don't have another account??????
Deletedavid, shouldn't you be fapping to hara while hiding from your mom?
Deletescatter, no one gives a shit about affiliates like gayvid said
AS, nope still don't care about you
Soyeon, shouldn't you be making another shit post with gay photoshops? Better yet, stick to your sports blog.
Anyway, inb4 bawb's lame attempt at getting the last word in again! i'm suprised you have time for this between making creepy as shit comments about idols and banning people from chat with different opinions from you. That seems like a full time job!
lmao who are you
Deletethe cheat ?
DeleteLOLOLOLOLOL
DeleteI should have recognized the argument style.
http://pastebin.com/Mxcwykch
Someone is SALTY
P.S. I never lifted the ban because several people thanked me afterwards. Apparently they had also been lured into running around in illogical circles on multiple occasions.
Deletethat was my first guess - no pun intended
Deleteuncanny similarity in style lol
How dare you sully The Cheat's fine name.
Deletei didnt mean it, knew it wasnt u dawg, i was gonna say windgl to troll her instead of u
Delete"hoopraFebruary 1, 2013 at 1:05 PM
Deletethe cheat ?"
+1 imaginary internet points to you.
it aint the cheat
Deletechill fags....
Deletei wonder if ajussi is still a Sica fan after this
ReplyDeleteOn the bright side, they're making progress from seppuku.
ReplyDeleteThis is hilarious. Incredibly fucking retarded, but hilarious.
ReplyDeleteWahhhhhh pages and pages of text....gg motherfuckers
ReplyDelete@Ice_princess; Looking away is NOT how you treat something bad. Bad things have to be discussed and not swept under the rug.
ReplyDeletethere should be a picture with a Korean celebrity and this woman. And on the Korean side it should say, "Caught having sex with 'X' person, Netizens think they're married." Then on the Japanese side, "Caught having sex with 'X' person, Company shaves her head." T'would be a good comparison.
ReplyDeletebump
ReplyDeletewords
ReplyDeleteso
ReplyDeletemany
ReplyDeletewords
ReplyDeletePoor thing, I heard the idol industry was strict, but seriously, they made her shave her head because she actually took interest in a person of the opposite sex, which is something normal at her age? Fuck, what is wrong with her motherfucking managers?
ReplyDeleteAlso, screw crazed AKB fanboys/fangirls, let them tear up her posters and trash their shit. These idolgroup members are only human, they make mistakes, no need to go batshit crazy.
Also, here's an article about not being allowed to date in the JP idol industry:
http://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2012/08/for-japans-justin-biebers-no-selena-gomezes-allowed/261181/
-"It's good business," says Dr. Laura Miller, a professor of Japanese studies and anthropology at the University of Missouri-St. Louis. "The group members are fantasy products, and allowing fans to imagine them as potential partners or as innocent and pure is part of their capital. It's in their interest and those who are trying to make money off them to keep their actual lives, personalities, and humanity separate. "-
That quote....
Deletewhat are these girls? Manufacture robots with no feelings? They feel love, they experience happiness and sadness and anger like the rest of the human population. Same thing can go for kpop idols & their fans. These girls aren't sex dolls/robots, they have feelings, they should be able to have private love lives without interference from their psycho, "I'll do anything for _____ because we'll get married one day!' fans, or god forbid, the company that manages them.
*SIGH*
Wtf happen, i she had shaved it.... let her wit her own life, she got the dick she deserve for...
ReplyDeletea girl got raped in alabama last week
ReplyDeleteso...
Fuck you, insane crazy dumbass boys
Fuck you police for not giving them the death sentence
fuck you government for hypocritically stating you will protect your citizens yet failing to do so
fuck you american society for wimping out and not bringing back the death penalty
nice rant by way!
anyways, i have no sympathy for her, i know, i know, i should be feeling for the poor bald chick and side with her against the big bad wolf (her agency) but seriously, she is the one that signed the damn contract, she knew what she was getting herself into but she possessed that typical human trait of not looking to the future. too blinded by the opportunity of a singing career that she and her parents failed to look into the future and fully assess the consequences of signing her soul and her body over to an agency that would like nothing more than to milk her (maybe even literally, who knows what these rich people do with their helpless employees)for as much as they can get.
anyways, this isn't a movie or anything, i see her as an insanely stupid figure rather than a tragic figure.
peace
a lot of women cut their hair or shave it when theyre having a break down
ReplyDeleteidk why
maybe they feel like by cutting their hair theyre starting fresh
lmao so much butthurt
ReplyDelete