Friday, July 29, 2011

Lets get serious

“And before I get the typical "if you don't like it get off the site" talk (which sounds like something a kpop fan would say *cough*). As much as these writers have a right to express their opinions, so do I. I'm pointing out what I find silly just as they do with Kpop”

Im writing this in response (and yes I know this is my second ‘response post’ but bare with me) to the Anon who wrote the above comment on this post . I suggest that you read his/her comment in its entirety.

Based on my experience with the fandom that I bash on the most (with very good reason), I find that I've encountered more delusional or crazy or unreasonable people than not.

I wouldn't just make a generalization if it wasn't somewhat accurate. Yeah sure I haven't done a scientific study/survey of all the fans to determine the numbers but, I'm making this estimate based on the ones that I've encountered.

And from that I’ve derived that most YG stans, mind you I said MOST not ALL, are conceited, pompous, ill informed (in terms of music) little kids who don’t know much about anything but have the biggest opinions. And yes there is nothing wrong with having an opinion, just like we all here do; but rather, what you do with that opinion and how you try to bring it across that determines whether or not it’s an opinion worth listening to.

I think that maybe the message with this blog is sometimes lost in translation, with the occasional trolling from some of us, but I think that this blog is really necessary. Yeah sure it’s not life saving or world changing but it’s an outlet for those of us who are kpop fans and who really enjoy this industry, but feel stifled by those in the fandom, who think that their idols are the absolute best EVER and can NEVER be criticized, because if you criticize you aren’t a real fan. And that is not true.

A real fan should have the freedom to be critical of their idols or people they admire, if they feel that there is REAL reason to do so. I’ll use myself as an example, I’m a Block b fan a really big one at that, I’ve been stanning those kids well before their debut. They have just made their comeback with the “New Kids on the block” mini album and when I first heard “Tell Them” I was shocked and disappointed to say the least. I didn’t think that it was a good song; I thought it was childish, too cute for the Block B that Cho had promised. I thought that they were playing it too safe, following the mold, when they really didn’t need to. I was able to express that to fellow BBCs and didn’t really care if censure followed,but I was pleasantly surprised to find that I wasn't the only one who felt that way.

This is something that fans of the really big fandoms (Im an elf so I know) can’t freely do and if they do, then they are "not real fans", because Oppa and Unnie are just so perfect. If I don’t like something, I should be able to say so and not have fear of raging fangirls spamming me with hate mail and accusations.

41 comments:

  1. I love your post :)

    That's exactly how I feel and I love Tell Them by block B!!! lol

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  2. <3 Thank you for this.

    (haha I had no idea that the Piggy Dolls article would raise so much silliness. But to be expected I suppose)

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  3. In any case, this blog would encounter this problem beginning with how people react with its name.

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  4. Damn girl, you sure like to snap off.

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  5. Theres going to be people like them here because of what the blog writes about. What that anon doesnt realise is that with 13 authors theres bound to be conflict of interest and, opinions. Which is funny because thats how it is in the kpop delusion fandom, they dont realise that other people have different opinions

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  6. I'll be defending this blog. :)

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  7. "Yeah sure I haven't done a scientific study/survey of all the fans to determine the numbers"

    Well, there was that recent poll of "which kpop couple is the most real?"

    And literally thousands of people voted for Yunho/Jaejoong. That shows you some of the crazy.

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  8. Did we really need an article on this? -_- Most of us go to this site because we're NOT serious!

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  9. Article not needed. There are only a couple of trolls here who resent you bashing oppa.

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  10. I resent all of you.

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  11. As a blackjack, i'm sick of seeing that i'm delusional, even when I say relevant things.
    And it's not because I enjoy 2ne1 that I have no musical tastes. I DO listen to what you call 'quality music' but for me a good sound is an entertaining one.
    I don't really like bjs either (3 of them are exceptions.) but I like 2ne1.
    All that to say (like you said) that not all bjs (or vip, elf, sones or whatever) are delusional and crazy. You said that but you (all) don't behave like you really think that.

    But I like this blog, it's really funny but sometimes ... Really confusing.
    And to end my novel, you guys give an honest opinion okay, but lots of your readers are also what you're criticising: butthurt stans that shit on the group that threatens their idols.

    Keep writing though but don't feed plain haters :)

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  12. <3 this. Said everything I wanted to say. :)

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  13. come on people we all know we cannot take anything that is posted in this blog seriously including this one.

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  14. Keep writing Liley-chan! The haters are the same reason this blog exsists!

    You tell the truth that the delusionals don't want to admit about their idols or the stuff they produce.

    It's refreshing to see a fan stick their head out of the ground where all the other fans seem to be and admit they have an issue with something.
    Yay, fellow ELF!

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  15. I completely agree with this post i encountered something close recently (in reference to criticizing my fav artist)...I'm a BIG SUJU fan and i wrote in one of their teaser pics
    Me: "I hope their new album would be as good as their 3rd album cos 4th wasn't really it or close to it at all but 3rd was my definition of Awesome with Sorry Sorry actually one of my least fav songs in it"
    ELF replies: "You should still support them no matter what, that's wat a REAL FAN does"
    Me: "Just cos i'm a big fan of theirs doesn't mean i have to like everything they put out. If they release something that's bad u bet i'll say it's bad and i'm not buying it just cos of buying it."
    Different elfs similar replies: "You're not a REAL FAN then cos u should still buy their cds regardless"
    Me: Well i consider myself a real fan cos by making them understand that their work isn't actually good that would make them be better artists by striving to be better. I'm a fan artist don't WANT but they NEED"

    I'm one of those very few non-delusional fans and i think every fandom needs more of those and not being 90% delusional.....

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  16. Personally, I like when you guys cuss in your posts.
    It gives this blogsite character. Lolll

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  17. 2 words: MARRY ME! :)

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  18. in no world does any elf have any right to call out any other fan group, sorry. you should've just pretended not to like them if you wanted anyone to think of you as anything more than a fangirl

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  19. 11:41

    I got the same kind of bashing from Shawols. I just said that I prefer Onew's voice because Jonghyun sounds like he's dying when he sings imo and Onew's high notes (low notes everything really but I left that part out) and falsetto sound prettier than Jonghyun's to me. I got SO many damn replies about how "Jonghyun oppa is lead singer for a reason and he is the best singer in Korea! and Suju's kyuhyun can't even sing like Jjongie so stfu k?" Ugh, he had to be something in the group since he can't dance or rap...seriously, like WTF. If he wasn't in SM, would people seriously think he is as talented as they make him out to be??? Oh sm and the cray cray stans <3

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  20. Am also a Block B fan and I agree that Tell Them was a big disappointment. It's just plain idol pop which isn't the reason why I became interested in them. Halo made up for it though, I still hope that in the future they choose better title songs.

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  21. The main reason why I'm here to show opposition to the rabid K-pop fans as well as to defend this blog from ignoramuses.

    I'm a chocobo sound, but this chocobo sound is not to be underestimated!

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  22. @ 6:25
    LMAO! so true.

    Sorry, but every word in your posts seem to come off as BS and hate(mainly towards YG fans). just like you have your own opinions, YG stans( and other fans for that matter) have theirs. If they think one song is "the best", let them. What I've noticed from this blog is that authors and readers alike often confuse exaggerated support (i.e. "2NE1 IS THE BEST GIRL GROUP!" or BigBang will make it in America!) with delusion. As that anon had previously posted, fans RARELY actually mean exaggerated comments, and by no means show that they're delusional.

    I think it's pure BS that authors on this blog think that, because a certain group doesn't appeal to them, their bashing is valid because it's posted on an "opinionated blog", while at the same time calling their avid fans delusional. PURE BS! Just because your opinion conflicts with most fans' opinions and that you put it in an "opinionated blog" doesn't make it better. Sure, that's not the aim of all authors(and don't get me wrong, I've met some great authors and people here), but judging from most posts on this blog, I get this feeling that some authors basically have their heads up their asses and can't see that their bashing is pretty hypocritical. I mean srsly, who are y'all to be defining normalcy? Who are you to be saying that blank idol's music is crap because it doesn't appeal to your particular musical taste?



    TLDR: Y'all are hypocrites and opinions are all equal, no matter how enlightening you think yours are. Avid support does NOT equal delusion.

    Come at me, bro.

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  23. 6:25
    OMG I've said the same thing too bout JJong's voice, personally i prefer Onew's voice over his anytime anyday.....I really have never seen the big deal bout JJong's voice it just sounds weird to me.....

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  24. Thank you for proving my point.
    Your site has become no different than any other kpop fandom. Mostly reasonable people with a smattering of trolls that ruin the image of said group and of course fans that "defend" the object.
    You seem to have missed something though, the problem is that most fans I have encountered are NOT serious when they say something is perfect and I, and many of the fans I have encountered, openly criticize things or express disappointment (if you're insisting on talking about YG, 2NE1's attempt at I am the best japanese version has universally been a disappointment and yes even blackjacks have said so openly) and everyone is generally civilized although there will be people who heavily disagree. I recall making a post about disappointment in TOP and having a few people go ape shit but everyone else being civilized, considering my points and telling those 1 or 2 people to clam their tits (although lots of thumbing down was involved which is their valid opinion). Frankly this is better than what you get on several other online forums (because I do have an online life outside of Kpop. Last time I complained about a crappy graphics engine my account got hacked and don't get me started with the crybabies that run allkpop).
    So no, this doesn't clear anything up. Perhaps the reason you have run into so many "delusional" fans is because you take them seriously. If people were to take this site seriously most of you would be JUST as bad but you say you don't take yourselves seriously so why take a random fan who says that a new song is "the best" seriously? If you bothered to talk to that person (like people who post on the same forum tend to over time) you'll see they don't actually believe its "the best" but really like it and were overcome with excitement when they wrote that one comment which you based them on.
    I agree that a site that is more realistic about Kpop is needed and would be refreshing but that isn't what this site is. This is a breeding ground for hate, trolls and antis and you eagerly feed them. You don't really talk about the music but often about the idols themselves and you have an overly simplistic view of fandoms, especially if you are talking about international fans that are very different from domestic fandoms and much more varied.
    The closest thing to realistic has been allkpop's music reviews which have gotten a million times better although that writer often misses the mark in my opinion and is nostalgically biased toward indie and old school, but nonetheless the writer is often fair and gives a good explanation for scores given. I certainly have changed my mind about the reviews (but still think allkpop is overall unprofessional).
    None of you seem anywhere nearly as knowledgeable about music (or you don't show it) yet you criticize music and criticize fans for not having musical knowledge that you yourselves don't seem to have (even if you are more knowledgeable than the average kpop fan who is often 13 and hasn't been exposed to enough music because they are 13! How about exposing them to music instead of getting on their case about being what most 13 year olds are?), its mind-boggling that you manage to convince yourselves that you are somehow different.
    You are what allkpop used to be when they were writing articles about the year's ugliest new idols and making thinly veiled exaggerated compliments towards their biases (aka fap material). You are NOT the refreshing, honest and crazy free zone you probably think you are and that is my problem and what makes you either woefully ignorant or hypocrites.

    For those few writers who make valid arguments, keep at it.

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  25. ...I think this blog is needed, to put the knife-wielding-banner-tearing-fanclub-threatning-hatemail-sending("THAT WAS JUST ONE TIME, GET OVER IT") Sones,VIP's,BJ's, ELFS and etc

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  26. I see my post has magically disappeared....

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  27. @the first 6:25
    "in no world does any elf have any right to call out any other fan group, sorry. you should've just pretended not to like them if you wanted anyone to think of you as anything more than a fangirl"

    If you bothered to read the entire post and not just bits,like where i say im an elf you'd be a lot more selective in the way you respond.
    Id totally agree with your statement if i was one of those elfs who thought that Super Junior were the best thing EVER and made life changing music and really believed it.If I went around trying to shove my super junior delusions in peoples faces then yes id have no right to call anyone out,but I dont!

    "I think it's pure BS that authors on this blog think that, because a certain group doesn't appeal to them, their bashing is valid because it's posted on an "opinionated blog", while at the same time calling their avid fans delusional"

    That is not the case here,we bash the fans who think that their oppars and unnies cant be criticised or if a fan of said oppa and unnie says something that is contrary to the majority's opinion then that person is not a real fan.

    And that is what I was trying to say with this post,just explaining it from my point of view,I dont think that YG fans are delusional because they are fans of the idols,that would be so stupid,what makes them delusional is the shit they say,and dude there is evidence of it all over the internet,i dont make this shit up,i dont suck it out of thin air.

    I acknowledge that SM has crazy fans,who take shit too far,with writing idol names in blood but in my opinion YG stans are annoying.

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  28. I guess you guys couldn't handle the truth so you decided to delete my post...

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  29. ^
    We dont delete comments,if that was true than those two anons i just replied to would have had their comments deleted as well.

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  30. This page is directed against rabid K-pop fans, not at K-pop. Which part of that statement is so hard to understand in this blog?

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  31. We don't delete posts on here for the most part. I've only deleted one post (because it had nothing to do with the article) and david deleted one of my posts.

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  32. Thank you for proving my point.

    Your site is exactly like many kpop fandoms, mostly reasonable people with a smattering of trolls that ruin its image and people who feel the need to defend the object.

    What you seem to have missed is that most fans, at least the ones I have encountered, do NOT take things as seriously as you interpret them, especially if you are talking about international fandoms which are very different and much more varied than domestic ones. Just because someone says something is "the best" does not mean they actually believe that song is actually the best song in the world EVER, they just really like the song and were excited when they wrote that, yet you screencap it and use it as "evidence" of what that person 100% believes like an internet post on a fan site is some sort of diary. How many times have I heard someone say a pizza place or a game is "the best". Do they believe its the best pizza place in the world? No, but they really like and want you to give it a try probably. Nor have I encountered the kind of heavy resistance towards criticism you describe (if you're going to insist on talking about YG, 2NE1's attempt at a i am the best japanese version has been universally viewed as a failure, yes even by blackjacks who openly admitted their disappointment). In fact I once posted my disappointment in (various aspects of) TOP and for the most part people considered my points and, while many disagreed and thumbed my post down, were generally civilized when they responded and told the one of two people that went apeshit to calm their tits and that I was allowed to have an opinion.

    Compared to what I get on other sites (yes I have an online life outside Kpop), like getting my account hacked because I complained about a bad graphics engine (and don't get me started with the crybabies that run allkpop), I'd say the Kpop fans I've encountered are pretty tame. It might also have helped that I didn't word what I said rudely like a troll would (like, you know calling someone an ogre for example). I think people react better to an honest discussion than someone writing "hearing so and so's voice makes me want to die". If you are disrespectful than you will get disrespect in return. I have yet to honestly discuss an idol's short comings and have more than a couple of people react irrationally even if many disagreed. Attacks come to people who say something like "such and such is an ugly bitch who should die and never even though of being an idol". If someone told you your work was shit and you should go die you would be pretty pissed, but if someone says well I think part a) and b) need to be improved 99% of the time you'll get a rational, understanding response.

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  33. The hypocritical part is that you ask people not to take you seriously but you take everything you read on the internet so damn seriously. You honestly think those Teen Top fans are NEVER going to wear perfume again. I have no doubt that those posters were just exaggerating and are wearing perfume right now. It’s the internet, people exaggerate. Few of the fans ever honestly mean the things they spazz about, it’s in the moment. Those few people get crazy and obsessed are often children, 13 year olds, and I have news for you, (I don't know if you've ever worked with children) that is how 13 years old behave. They go through phases, become obsessed with something (and spend a ridiculous amount of money on crazy things like the companies want) and get stubborn when someone challenges them until they grow out of it. If this is what your site is working against, I'd say you're fighting a losing battle, adolescent psychology is not likely to change anytime soon and so it seems what you have a problem with is normal teenage (and younger)behavior.

    And furthermore, those 13 years old may very well not know much about music, although it doesn't seem many of you do either as you hardly comment on a song except that it's good or it sucks, but how about exposing them to some other music instead of hating on them for being young and obviously unaware of EVERY musical genre and music that came out before their parents were born. I have had nothingbut good responses when I throw up old school music or a different genre, most people listen to stuff and give it a chance and they learn and grow from it. Don't expect musical sophistication from teenagers or even adults, not everyone is a music expert. You people don't critique music or help fans expand their knowledge base, allkpop (as terribly unprofessional as they are), have come the closest with Way Back Wednesdays and a decent music critic (who has gotten a million times better since s/he started), who I think misses the mark a lot but knows what they are talking about and gives a valid explanation for the rating given and is pretty consistent. It’s so ironic and hypocritical that you judge fans because they don't think they have knowledge that you don't seem to have yourselves. Oh and a kid thinking they know everything? Yeah that's not normal at all *rolls eyes*. Again if that's what you are fighting against, it’s pointless. It’s better to disagree nicely, throw up a dennis brown video (or maybe desmond deker's little suzie for miss A fans) and move on.

    I do believe a place that is more honest about Kpop (and its real impact globally) is needed but this site isn't it. This site is what allkpop used to be when it was writing articles about the ugliest new idol and making thinly concealed, exaggerated compliments towards their biases (aka fap material). You are not the honest, refreshing, crazy-free zone you likely believe you are. This site has become a breeding ground for hate, antis and trolls whom you feed eagerly. Of course there are people who want you to continue, you validate their hate and pathetic troll behavior.

    For those few writers that make valid points, please continue and here's to hoping you have a good influence.

    (I broke the paragraphs up just for you 아저씨)

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  34. Anon
    You encountering more reasonable people than I doesnt make my point invalid.Again If you'll read this post I said "Based on my experience with the fandom that I bash on the most (with very good reason), I find that I've encountered more delusional or crazy or unreasonable people than not."
    This is my honest experience with this fandom. I used to like YG idols before i even for a short while tried to stan Big Bang,but the fans just had to ruin it for me,I tried stanning 2ne1 but again the fans ruined it for me,but I still enjoy CL,i may not like 2ne1 but her i like.

    I cant speak for the other contributors here,but I do know a thing or two about good music,I got into kpop with that knowledge already there.

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  35. ^when you diss idols and their fans, that makes you just the same as those crazy stans you bash. But if you make a more sound, respectful judgement, that makes you more respectable than them.

    ^
    ^agree.

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  36. @liley If you bothered to read what I wrote you'd understand that perhaps your attitude and the way you approach (online) people and what your expectations are has lead you to have a poor experience while I have had a different one.
    And what utter nonsense, the fans of a group has made you stop liking a group and their music? That is such rubbish, what do what fans do have to do with the group? It isn't as though 2NE1 or Big Bang or any other group encourages fans to act the way they do. If you like a song, then like it I honestly don't understand how the fandom could in any way change what the music sounds like to you. I don't like the lifestyle and violent sub-cultures related to gangster rap and metal but that doesn't mean I dismiss the music.
    This is another example of you being closed-minded. Perhaps if you opened it a little your experience with Kpop, among other things, would change.

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  37. The way I see it, THIS SITE IS FOR SHITS AND GIGGLES!
    I don't want to be constantly praising my biases for how good looking or good at singing they are...
    I want to be able to laugh about things and be able to laugh at my bias as well..
    This site, although bringing some good points against annoying-ass fans, also doesn't fail to put a smile on my face. :D
    No need to get all butthurt over these posts..

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  38. @anon id written a comment for you but something happened during the submitting process so yeah im done here.

    @anon 7:48
    hear,hear!

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